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No contact for Dad's - no money for Mum

After reading a post by someone reasonably high up here (unsure of name/nic), there was hint of discussion around resident parents I shouldnt just label mothers, who are deliberately witholding contact to the other parent if it is going to reduce their maintenance payment. How rottenly low disgusting and im the PAYEE. I fully support this idea and was wondering how much this has been looked into and if it is even a possible in the future. I certainly hope so for all non resident parents out there suffering at the hands of greedy low down payee's. Any information would be grateful, as I would love to keep monitoring this idea to see if it does come to fruition (fingers crossed).
unfortunately,  I'm in the same boat,  I would luv to have my kids spend more time and overnight stays with me but as this would reduce CS payments,  the mother will not allow it.

As for your topic No contact - no Money,  I've raised a number of topics/discussion around this topic on this site and my comment is that, if a payer takes the payee to court for contact contraventions and if FM rules in for the payer, ie, has found that the payee has contravened contact orders,,,  then CSA should reduce/withhold CS payments to the payee.  In my case, I spent thousands in legal costs,  I won all contraventions but left with a debt to pay legal cost AND still pay CS…

If CS payments was reduced/withdrawn,  how many payees will then stop children having contact with the payers  ….   !!!!
I agree resident parents need to stop cashing in on children in the end its about the kids but i guess not everybody sees that way. My daughter refuses to see her biological father as he did the wrong thing by her (mental abuse) and I still receive child support but personally if this was stopped i wouldnt give a hoot. It would be better to receive no money than have her mental health issues resurface all because of money NO THANKS. its a pretty black and white policy i dont see why it shouldnt become legislation. Vote me into parliament!
I've long been of the opinion, that for most, a presumption of 50/50 care should reign, this rebuttable by either parent upon the parent wishing to alter the 50/50 to then take on the cost of that variance. e.g. if a parent asks for and can get agreement with greater time, that they then pay the extra CS (if their income/liability is greater) or get no further CS for their wish. If the parent asks for and can get agreement for less time, that they then pay extra CS or receive no extra CS.

If that were the case, then I would guess that there would be far fewer denying their children their humane right to know and be cared for by their parents. I guess it would also reduce claims of of Domestic Violence, child abuse ….. and  make the whole process of separation less adversarial. Perhaps this could also be extended to situations of a fine, the amount being similar to as if  it were an agreement, should a parent deny contact without agreement. I guess a further dispute resolution process would also be required.

I also personally see that the new legislation has pitfalls with sudden changes and that the calculation of CS should be smoothed so even if a parent has just 1 night's care/contact that that reduces the CS. I'm pretty sure that we have heard of example on here where the barriers (14% and 35%), which can make a great difference in CS paid received, are being used to form plans/orders.
I'm speaking to a lot of people of late that are having spanners thrown into contact arrangements because C.S.A. have sent out new assessments.

It seems that the payer is being ask to provide proof of contact to reduce payments when the X is stating that contact is less, and many who only have parenting plans or no court orders are simply being refused contact.

I wonder if this trend will continue and more people be forced to lodge contempt orders or be forced to obtain consent orders.

I sort of got the idea that C.S.A. would respect those agreements and not positively reinforce bad behaviour from those who use the system as a cash carrier.
D4E, when I get home I intend to look at this in more depth. My understanding is that if there is an agreement in writing then that goes and that as much one parent has to prove the contact then so does the other, in fact I'm pretty sure it even mentions oral agreements, but I have to check the stuff that I have at home (at work today and it's busy because we're moving to a new level).

Unfortunately I think this sort of thing was bound to happen, far too often it's about getting money, rather than about the child.

What I'd like to see is get all those seeing their children exploited and abused in this way to get together and act as a group to fight this. Even though it's not happening to me, it's an area where I'd like to get involved in and I guess many others would.
I'd appreciate that MikeT, I try and get as many as I can to ask legal questions here but many just seem to have the opinion that they don't have a right, if I can pass on some hope it may encourage them to look further into pressing their rights.

I guess once the courts start filling up with contraventions and the reasons for being names as CS there will be adjustments to the legislation.

When you are swimming down a creek and an eel bites your cheek, that's a Moray.
D4E,
        here's the stuff, basically the legislation and a booklet (I've also posted this in the "Ping Pong Parenting Topic", as it may help Glyn out) :-

Here's the relevant pages :-

The new Child Support Scheme and changes to Family Assistance said
How are care arrangements recognised?
To make sure the Child Support Agency (CSA) and Centrelink have the same information about care from both parents and can therefore calculate your payments correctly, we recommend you have one of the following in place:

  • a written parenting plan
  • an agreement (verbal or written) with the other parent about the level of care
  • a court order about care, which you have supplied to the CSA.


Parents will have up to 13 weeks to work out parenting arrangements after they separate before family assistance is affected. If parents cannot agree on care levels, and have not made a parenting plan or obtained a court order, then care levels will be determined by CSA and Centrelink after talking to both parents (where possible).


Parenting plans
Parenting plans are written plans that can include an agreement about the amount of time the children will be in each parent's care. A parenting plan doesn't need to spell out the exact arrangements for every night in the year; parents can agree on what the care percentage will be.

Under the new Scheme, a parenting plan is the best way for parents who have significant and regular daytime care to have it recognised in their assessment. While the formula is based on care measured by number of nights, it has the flexibility to cover the very small number of customers who have significant regular daytime caring responsibilities and no night time responsibilities, in some circumstances. If you have an arrangement like this, we recommend you and the other parent make a parenting plan and provide a copy to the Child Support Agency (CSA).

Because all parents with 14 to 34 per cent care (52 to 127 nights a year) are taken to meet the same 24 per cent of the child's costs through care, it doesn't matter what the exact percentage in this range is. This means parents can be flexible about changes to care within this range, without worrying about the effect on child support.

If you have a parenting plan, it's still current and CSA has a copy of it, we can base your care levels in your child support assessment on the plan. If care changes, we recommend you try to make a new parenting plan.

Oral agreements
Parents can make oral agreements about their care arrangements. An oral agreement can be used to determine parents' levels of care even where there is a court order or parenting plan, so long as both parents agree with the arrangements.

If one parent doesn't agree with the oral agreement and there is a parenting plan or court order registered with CSA, the care level used in the assessment will be what is stated in the order or plan.

This makes oral agreements a good option for parents who want to try out new care arrangements before they make a new parenting plan. Like parenting plans, oral agreements don't need to spell out every night of the year for example, parents can agree that they each have 50 per cent care.

Court orders
If there?s a court order that outlines care levels, your child support assessment will be based on the order unless both parents agree to change it, for example by parenting plan or oral agreement. The Child Support Agency (CSA) has no legal ability to enforce levels of care specified in court orders. If orders are contravened, either parent may seek legal advice, attend family dispute resolution or apply to the Family Court.

When there are changes to care
Where possible, try to make a new parenting plan or agreement. For child support purposes, very small changes in care don't significantly change the costs that parents meet, so it might not change child support payments. This gives parents more flexibility about small changes in care without worrying about the effect on child support.

If care arrangements don?t work out
If one parent doesn?t meet their care obligations and doesn?t seek a new agreement, parenting plan, or order despite the other parent's efforts, CSA can change the assessment to reflect the actual care.

The Family Relationship Advice Line provides free information, advice and referral to services to assist people affected by family relationship or separation issues, including developing and reaching agreement on parenting arrangements. For more information call 1800 050 321 or go to www.familyrelationships.gov.au

CSA's Community Services Directory lists over 2,200 community support services for separated families. Go to the CSA website www.csa.gov.au for more information and to access the Directory.

If care arrangements change
Tell CSA and Centrelink about any changes to care levels as soon they happen.
And here's the relevant part of the legislation (hopefully with the more pertinent stuff highlighted):-

Child Support Legislation Amendment (Reform of the Child Support Scheme–New Formula and Other Measures) Act 2006 said
Division 4–Percentage of care
Subdivision A–Preliminary


47A  Simplified outline
        The following is a simplified outline of this Division:
-    A person's (whether the person is a parent or a non parent carer of a child) percentage of care for the child for a day in a child support period is the percentage of care of the child that the person is likely to have during a 12 month period.
-    A percentage of care for a child is as determined by an oral agreement or a parenting plan made by the parents of the child (or a parent and a non parent carer), or as determined by a court order.
-    The Registrar can make a determination of a person's percentage of care for a child in certain cases (such as if there is no such agreement, plan or order, or if care of the child changes).
-    A parent's percentage of care for a child is used in section 55C to work out the parent's cost percentage for the child.
-    A non parent carer's percentage of care is used in section 40A to work out how much child support the non parent carer is entitled to be paid for the child.
  47B  Meaning of court order
        In this Division:
court order means:
    (a)    a family violence order within the meaning of section 4 of the Family Law Act 1975; or
    (b)    a parenting order within the meaning of section 64B of the Family Law Act 1975; or
    ©    a State child order registered in accordance with section 70D of the Family Law Act 1975; or
    (d)    an overseas child order registered in accordance with section 70G of the Family Law Act 1975.
  Subdivision B–Determining percentages of care
48  Working out percentage of care
    (1)    A person's percentage of care for a child for a day in a child support period is the percentage of care of the child that the person is likely to have during the period (the care period) of 12 months from:
    (a)    the day on which an application is made under section 25 or 25A for a parent to be assessed in respect of the costs of the child; or
    (b)    the day on which the Registrar becomes aware of the following:
    (i)    a change of at least 7.1% in the percentage of care of the child that the person has;
    (ii)    that the person's percentage of care for the child has fallen below 14%;
    (iii)    that the person's percentage of care for the child has increased to 14%, or above 14%.

Note:    The Registrar is not entitled to amend an administrative assessment in respect of a person's percentage of care unless the Registrar becomes aware of an event mentioned in paragraph (1)(b) (see subsection 75(2)).
    (2)    The percentage of care is to be worked out in accordance with this Subdivision.
Note:    Generally, a person's percentage of care for a child is worked out based on the number of nights that the child is likely to be in the care of the person during the care period.
    (3)    If a person's percentage of care worked out in accordance with this Subdivision is not a whole percentage:
    (a)    if the percentage is greater than 50%–the percentage is rounded up to the nearest whole percentage; and
    (b)    if the percentage is less than 50%–the percentage is rounded down to the nearest whole percentage.
 49  Agreements, parenting plans and court orders may determine percentage of care
        The percentage (if any) of care of a child that a parent or non parent carer is likely to have during a care period is determined in accordance with the following agreement, plan or order if the Registrar is satisfied that the agreement, plan or order allows such a percentage to be determined:
    (a)    if the relevant application for administrative assessment for child support for the child is made under subparagraphs 25A(b)(ii) to (iv) (application by non parent carer in relation to one parent):
    (i)    an oral or written agreement, or parenting plan, between the parent and a non parent carer of the child that the Registrar is satisfied has been made; or
    (ii)    a court order that relates to the parent and a non parent carer of the child, or that relates to the child;
    (b)    otherwise:
     (i)    an oral agreement between the parents of the child that the Registrar is satisfied has been made; or
     (ii)    a parenting plan for the child that has been entered into by the parents; or
     (iii)    a court order that relates to the parents, or that relates to the child.
 50  Registrar determinations where no agreement, plan or order
    (1)    The Registrar must determine the percentage (if any) of care of a child that a parent or non parent carer of the child is likely to have during the relevant care period if there is no agreement, plan or order that allows such a percentage to be determined under section 49.
    (2)    In making the determination, the Registrar must take into account such period as is required in order for the Registrar to be satisfied that there is, has been, or will be, a pattern of care for the child.
    (3)    The Registrar may revoke or vary a determination made under this section.
 Subdivision C–Changes to percentages of care
51  Person no longer agrees with oral agreement
         If:
    (a)    an oral agreement determines, under section 49, a percentage of care of a child that a parent or non parent carer is likely to have during a care period; and
    (b)    the Registrar becomes aware that a parent or non parent carer of the child no longer agrees with that percentage of care; and
    ©    immediately before the oral agreement was made, a parenting plan or court order determined the percentage of care of the child that each parent or non parent carer would have during the care period;
the percentage of care of the child that a parent or non parent carer is likely to have during the care period is as determined in accordance with the parenting plan or court order.

 52  Interim Registrar determinations where parent or non parent carer does not agree with percentages of care
    (1)    The Registrar may determine the percentage (if any) of care of a child that a parent or non parent carer of the child is likely to have during the relevant care period if:
    (a)    there is an agreement, plan or order that allows such a percentage to be determined under section 49; and
    (b)    a parent or non parent carer of the child does not agree that the care of the child that is actually taking place is in accordance with the percentage so determined; and
    ©    in the circumstances of the case, the percentage so determined would result in an unjust and inequitable determination of the level of financial support to be provided by a parent for the child; and
    (d)    a parent or non parent carer of the child has taken reasonable action:
    (i)    to seek to reach agreement; or
    (ii)    to seek a court order; or
    (iii)    to enforce a court order;
        about the care of the child; and
    (e)    a parent or non parent carer of the child applies for the determination.
Note:    If the Registrar refuses to make a determination under this section, the Registrar must give the applicant a notice under section 54.
    (2)    In making the determination, the Registrar must take into account such period as is required in order for the Registrar to be satisfied that there is, has been, or will be, a pattern of care for the child.
    (3)    The Registrar may revoke or vary a determination made under this section.
    (4)    Before the end of 6 months after a determination is made under this section, the Registrar:
    (a)    must review the determination; and
    (b)    may make another determination under this section.
53  Registrar determination where parent's care falls below 14%
Making a determination
    (1)    The Registrar may determine the percentage (if any) of care of a child that a parent or non parent carer is likely to have during a care period if:
    (a)    a parent (the first parent) was to have at least regular care of the child during the relevant care period under an oral agreement, parenting plan or court order; and
    (b)    the first parent has no care, or has a pattern of care that is less than regular care, of the child despite the other parent or a non parent carer making the child available to the first parent; and
    ©    the other parent or a non parent carer of the child applies for the determination.
Note:    If the Registrar refuses to make a determination under this section, the Registrar must give the applicant a notice under section 54.
Day on which determination commences
    (2)    The determination must specify, in accordance with subsections (4) and (5), the first day in the child support period to which the determination is to apply.
    (3)    The determination applies to the day specified, and later days in the child support period.
    (4)    If the Registrar is satisfied that the other parent or the non parent carer who applied for the determination failed, within a reasonable period, to notify the Registrar that the first parent had no care, or less than regular care, of the child during the relevant care period, the day specified must be the day on which the determination is made.
    (5)    Otherwise, the day specified must be:
    (a)    if the first parent never established a pattern of care in accordance with the oral agreement, parenting plan or court order–the day on which the plan or court order was entered into or made; or
    (b)    if the first parent established a pattern of care in accordance with the oral agreement, parenting plan or court order, but later ceased the established pattern of care–the day on which the parent ceased the previously established pattern.
    (6)    To avoid doubt, a parent never establishes a pattern of care if:
    (a)    the parent could not have established the pattern of care until a particular period that occurs later in the child support period; and
    (b)    the parent does not establish that pattern during that particular period.
    (7)    The Registrar may revoke or vary a determination made under this section.
Registrar to make determination under this section (and not interim determination)
    (8)    If the Registrar could make a determination under section 52 and this section in respect of the percentage of care for a child, the Registrar must make a determination under this section and not section 52.
54  Notice to be served if Registrar refuses application
    (1)    If the Registrar refuses to make a determination under section 52 or 53, the Registrar must serve written notice of the decision on the person who made the application.
    (2)    The notice must include, or be accompanied by, a statement to the effect:
    (a)    that the person may, subject to the Registration and Collection Act, object to the particulars of the assessment in relation to which the person sought to make the application; and
    (b)    that if the person is aggrieved by the decision on the objection, he or she may, subject to that Act, apply to the SSAT for review of the decision.
Subdivision D–Where there is more than one agreement, plan, order or determination

55  Where there is more than one agreement, plan, order or determination
    (1)    If more than one agreement, plan, order or determination applies, under section 49, 50, 52 or 53, to a day in a child support period, then the percentage of care of a child that a parent or non parent carer is likely to have during the care period is as determined by the most recent agreement, plan, order or determination.
    (2)    However, the most recent agreement, plan or determination is subject to any court order made in respect of the percentage of care of a child that specifies that the order cannot be altered by agreement between the persons in respect of whom the order is made.
The other place to look is the CSA Guide section 2.2.5, this will take you to section 2.2.5 (2.2.4 and 2.2.6 may also be relevant, there's links in section 2.2.5 to them).

Here's the links :-

The CSA Booklet (New Child Support Scheme and changes to Family Assistance)
The CS Reforms Legislation New Formula and other measures
:thumbs:
So basically a huge backfire and a whole set of new problems?

They need to seperate the money from the contact and have them as two COMPLETELY different issues.

When you are swimming down a creek and an eel bites your cheek, that's a Moray.
LFs,
right you are - was called by the CSA last week they wanted to pre warn me that because i have less than 35% care of my daughter i will not recieve the FTB part B from july 1.

monaro said
LFs, ….was called by the CSA last week they wanted to pre warn me that because i have less than 35% care of my daughter i will not recieve the FTB part B from july 1.
I think you will find it was actually part A they are talking about and NOT part B. The offset is the new revised formula, the two incomes used, new CAP, MATAWE relationship and the revised protected amounts. Also a trap for the unwary is you cannot automatically go into a new bracket unles you have a 7.1% or more, change of contact.

Executive Secretary - Shared Parenting Council of Australia
 Was my post helpful? If so, please let others know about the FamilyLawWebGuide whenever you see the opportunity
 
secretary,
i was definately told part B, i spent a good 15 min debating with them about it, they told me i will no longer receive part B due to the fact that i had my daughter less than 35% of the time?

monaro said
secretary,
i was definately told part B, i spent a good 15 min debating with them about it, they told me i will no longer receive part B due to the fact that i had my daughter less than 35% of the time?
They are wrong. It is part A. See the link here describing part A and B (Old system)

Family Tax Benefit Part A is an annual tax benefit to help families with the cost of raising children.

Guardians, including foster parents and grandparents, responsible for the day-to-day care of children/grandchildren may be eligible for Family Assistance and should contact the Family Assistance Office at Centrelink for more information.

You may get Family Tax Benefit Part A if you:

-   have a dependent child under 21 (including a foster child), or
-   have a dependent full time student aged 21 to 24, and
-   have income under a certain amount, and are living in Australia (that is, Australia is your permanent home), and
-   you are either an Australian citizen, a New Zealand citizen, the holder of a permanent visa or the holder of certain temporary visas.

Family Tax Benefit Part B gives extra assistance to families with one main income, including sole parents, where the youngest dependent child is under 16 (or up to 18 if they are a full time student and do not receive Youth Allowance or a similar payment).

It also gives extra assistance to families who have a child under the age of five.

You cannot receive Family Tax Benefit for a dependent who is:

-   your partner
-   aged between 5 and 15 years, not undertaking full-time study and has a taxable income of $11 929 or more
-   aged 16 or over and has a taxable income of $11 929 or more
-   any age and receiving a social security pension or benefit or a payment under a labour market program.

If you are a single income family or a sole parent, Family Tax Benefit Part B gives you an extra payment to help with the cost of raising children. It also gives extra help if your family has a child under the age of five years.

Family Tax Benefit Part B gives extra assistance to families with one main income, including sole parents, where the youngest dependent child is under 16 (or up to 18 if they are a full time student and do not receive Youth Allowance or a similar payment). It also gives extra assistance to families who have a child under the age of five.

Now here is the new bit
Q: How will my payments be affected by the level of care I give?
A: Child support payments calculated under the new formula will reflect each parent's level of care and how much it costs parents to care for their children.

Under the new formula, the 109 night (30 per cent) threshold has been removed. From 1 July 2008, where a parent has care of the child for between 14 and 34 per cent of the nights of the year, 24 per cent of the cost of the child will be taken to be met through the provision of that care. This will reduce the possibility of payments changing as a result of small changes in care, and help to remove incentives for a parent to restrict contact with the other parent.

Where parents have care for at least 35 per cent of the time, a sliding scale will increase the direct cost percentage (reflects the costs you incur when you provide care for your child) as care increases, from 25 per cent up to 50 per cent. So, a parent will be recognised as meeting 50 per cent of the costs of children if their care percentage is between 48 to 52 per cent (equal to 176-189 nights per year).

It's up to parents to manage care arrangements that are in the best interests of the children. Under the new Scheme, the child support formula will recognise the care each parent has of their children, and small changes will not affect payments as much as they do under the current formula.

Q: It says that if you have care for less than 35% you don't receive family assistance for that child anymore. How is that right when these parents still have to meet costs for those children?
A: The new way of working out child support payments will recognise the expenses of non-resident parents who have contact with their children.

From 1 July 2008, a parent who has care of a child for less than 35% of the time will not be eligible for the child related components of Family Tax Benefit. Instead of receiving Family Tax Benefit, a parent who has care of a child between 14% to less than 35% of the time will have the costs of the child taken into account in working out how much child support the parent will pay. This level of care is called 'regular care' and will be counted as meeting 24% of the costs of the child for child support purposes. For most child support payers, this will reduce the amount paid. A parent with regular care of a child will continue to be eligible for the rent assistance component of Family Tax Benefit Part A and certain other government benefits.

Perhaps the CSA officer you spoke to might like to review this post. By the way all of this information is in this forum and FAQ's which was in the child support area but is not on the menu at the moment due to maintenance. There is more about this in the Child Support section and Child Support Fact Sheets … i.e  Allow resident parents to keep all of their Family Tax Benefit except where there is shared care (35 per cent or more). The ability to split Family Tax Benefit can be a source of conflict, where arguments can occur over every percentage point of care. The costs of care are now recognised in the amount of child support payable.

What is clear is that although this information is here on the site you have either not been able to find it , or have not looked that hard. If it is the former that really concerns us as we have put a massive effort into getting content here. :(

Executive Secretary - Shared Parenting Council of Australia
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LifeInsight said
SSPCA - What bracket are you referring to for the 7% change in care to apply? Ok I just worked out that 7% care is 12 hours a week.
No problem these things are complex. What I am saying is the change of care % required to effect a new "bracket" of care band or any level of care formula. Here is the FAQ link which will be in the WEB GUIDE Child Support menu shortly. If it still doesn't make sense please respond and we will do better at giving examples.

Remember care now falls into BANDS of CARE or officially LEVELS of care and from memory there are 5… These are:
Below regular = 0% to 13%
Regular = 14% to 34%
Shared = 35% to 65%
Primary = 66 to 86%
Above Primary = 87% to 100%

As you move between bands the FTB PART A rates / formula changes

We completely overlooked this small amendment in the provisional Act and it has come back to bite us. i.e What it means is you cannot get a few nights extra contact and slip into a higher care level (bracket) and thus expect to re calculate FTB part A. (Get some FTB part A back)

If for example you have 34% care (Regular) = no FTB A and you slip into 38% care (Shared) = You would think you can get part of FTB part A because thats allowed in a bracket above 35% (Shared) …. BUT (here is the gotcha!) you can't have any FTB part A even though you are now in a band of care that entitles you to rebated FTB part A, because the % change is not 7.1% or greater..

Our bigger issue around loss of FTB part A is in fact the benificeries and low income earners who will loose nett income… O_o

Executive Secretary - Shared Parenting Council of Australia
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They have really done their homework concerning standard agreements that already exist where a father thinks his entitlement is every second weekend and half the school holidays, the unofficial norm that has been around for some time.

It is pretty much a neutralizing balancing act as far I can see.

I would suggest in the majority of these cases there would be limited knowledge of FTB A&B  being able to be claimed prior, This would suggest in a large percentage of cases 100% of these payments.

If you look at the fact that approaching the courts for a change of orders to increase time with the child could be viewed as an attempt to access this money as well as reduce child support it adds another factor into the mix, in other words that extra 12 hours per week could be viewed tactical.

If the recipient has been obtaining 100 % of FTB A&B but level of care has had the payee of CSA in the category to claim a portion of this but has not, the recipient of both CSA and FTB A&B will in fact have a reduction in funds.

Does this effectively balance out this in regards to the payee in this scenario ??

Being on a Pension with a budget that allows for little to no savings this subtle change would see many not being able to afford time with their children, lately things have been going up so fast that the pension doesn't even cover living for yourself let alone a few extra mouths as well.

I will say that I am one of the more fortunate who has 50/50 and things do not change as much for.

My heart goes out to those dads on  benefits with limited care this is so wrong and destructive for all in this position.
LifeinSight, generally it's based upon nights care not hours of care, although there is scope in the legislation for daytime care to be considered, but by the sounds of it getting blood from the stone may well be the simpler task.

The New Legislation said

(2) The percentage of care is to be worked out in accordance with this Subdivision.

Note:          Generally, a person's percentage of care for a child is worked out based on the number of nights that the child is likely to be in the care of the person during the care period.

However saying that, generally, does not exclude daytime nor hours being considered. I can find no other mention of the word night, nor a mention of daytime (day will find a large number of hits so not going there). Hour only appears in relation to work and school. What this means as to whether hours can be used, as far as the legislation goes is beyond my comprehension of how legislation is interpreted. Although I do recall somewhere saying something along the lines that it should be taken as read unless there is specifically something to contrary (my words).

I'm also unsure as to whether the 7.1% could actually be 8% due to the rounding that is applied. One would think that it would have to be before rounding, otherwise why not say 8%? However it could also mean 7%, as with rounding 7.1% care for the one parent where the amount is rounded down to 7% would be 8% to the other parent rounded up, so as that other parent is liable to notify the change in care, their change in care should affect any change.

P.S. the rest of the legislation around percentage of care is in one of my previous posts in this topic.
Maybe instead of nights they could use 'number of sleeps' (including daytime naps)
Or maybe 'quality time minutes' or 'play time' or 'good food times'.

i am just not sure the government is intervening enough. Surely the highly paid 'policy people' could invent more exciting and invasive terminology? :thumbs:

 Maybe I am not explaining myself well enough
Lifeinsight,
              I agree and furthermore I completely disagree with the 7.1% rule, care is care. If it costs one it costs the other. I also believe that the various care levels should be done away with and a graduated curve be used, and that care by the hour or even minute be catered for.
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