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CSA Online Petition

I'm sure this has been done before but, with 98 days to the election, would it be worth doing again?  I'm up for starting it if anyone is up for helping with the wording.  Something along the lines of closing down CSA and transferring responsibility to the ATO.
Give me the means and I'll do it all if you like mate. All I need to know is how to generate an online petition and I can take it from there. I want them buried!
Start a petition · Change.org  Starting point maybe??
Hi Julco,

I think if managed and promoted could draw some attention. Maybe a dedicated Facebook page would assist with the social media aspect of promotion as well and a Youtube video maybe.

Do you know anything about Kellie Tranter the Human Rights Lawyer? I came across her website recently and don't really know anything about her or what her position is on the CSA.

It might be worth checking out to see if she will support the cause as some of the recent stories such as Endure's are heartbreaking.

This is the website:  http://kellietranter.com/

What do you think?
I'm not the most 'literate' person on this website but I am willing to contact Ms Tranter to a view to helping with an online petition, unless Sleepy has things under control.  I can't see any facebook pages at the moment that are against CSA, quite a few about dead beat dads though…anyone a wiz with Facebook?  Endure, would you be willing to come onboard?   Can someone also let me know what legal pitfalls (other than disclosure orders) would be faced.  I suppose the greatest thing in all of this would be the willingness for people to lose their anonimity.
Julco maybe this forum would support an online survey that can be accessed by everyone. This would be similar to a petition and if designed properly may have a similar effect as a petition. The results can be presented to all of the relevant bodies and may be viewed as more constructive in terms of identifying a broad spectrum of issues within the current systems of CSA and SSAT.

I have no clue as to what would achieve an outcome but happy to try.
Hi Alessandro, would this be possible?  I've managed to get a facebook page 'close down CSA'…but I still think privacy is going to be the killer.  Personally I really don't give a toss anymore…!
Given that the CSA are a law unto themselves, it wouldn't surprise me if they made life (more) difficult for people who posted on a Facebook page therefore this sort of thing should be done in a manner which provides anonymity (of course a Facebook page could be used to point to the site that hosts the petition).

Change.org is a good site and also provides the ability for people to "Share" with their Facebook friends the fact they signed the petition.  This makes it harder for trolls (i.e. CSA staff in disguise) to post hate comments.

Last edit: by wharty

I don't think that CSA staff would be troubled by such campaigns. Their exemptions from scrutiny and multiple layers of legal and administrative protections seem to have gifted them a mentality of judge, jury and executioner. In reality their agency isn't far off that description.

I think that in order to attract enough support any public campaign will need a positive spin (as in "This initiative will save the taxpayer/improve cost effectiveness" etc) and mustn't sound like we're trying to shirk parental responsibilities. We all know that that's not what we're hoping for but considering the deadbeat dad mentality the two Joes have bred, it'll almost certainly be labelled accordingly unless it's a concerted and sensible approach from the beginning.

If a petition is pitched to both payers and payees, it'll appeal to a wider audience. We all know that CSA has little to no regard for the former but my research suggests that payees are just as dissatisfied as we are.

As a general rule I think the most effective approach would be to aim high (complete abolition of CSA and resumption of the ATO managing all income matters) with the widest possible appeal including payees.

I'm flat out with both jobs for the next two weeks (yep, due to paying 2k per month in CS it's the only way I can get ahead) but after that I'll put everything I've got into this.

This war in winnable.
Does anyone know how many people you need to sign up to the petition before a Federal member will attempt to pass a bill?

What if I was able to get an independant female law student working in a legal practice to place a petition on their website?

This would keep the eprson anonymous but may get the support. Just discussing the CSA with an old friend from Melbourne on the weekend disclosed that he offered to keep paying the child support until the both children completed their HSC and it was rejected by the CSA..even if you are a model dad they still can't cope. Apparently he had to get the ex to submit an application to have it extended.
Alessandro said
Does anyone know how many people you need to sign up to the petition before a Federal member will attempt to pass a bill?
I don't believe there's a "magic" number.  I believe it all depends on whether the member trying to introduce a bill into parliament believes they'll benefit from such a bill i.e. greater number of constituents voting for them in an election.
Well they have passed a bill before but it was to do with cancer research and it was passed. I think if we can gather up enough support it may work.

I am waiting to hear back from them tomorrow.

This Web Designer I know just wipped up a survey for a marketing group and it is great. I could see something similar being quite a useful tool.

It's a shame the CSA don't survey every single client.

By the way we won our case yippee back to the SSAT.
The biggest issue is the "perception" that changes could disadvantage payee's (a majority who are female) and children.  This means many pollies will be reluctant to engage in meaningful conversation or put their hand up to introduce a bill.

Also, given that Gillard constantly harps on about Abbott being sexist and appears to be heading down the path of making sexism an election battlefield, it's unlikely that anyone would have the guts to do anything about the CSA issue (at the moment).

I'm not saying we shouldn't make a noise and I'd be more than happy to help out.  There's a big difference between "cancer research" and attacking a department implemented to "assist" single parents and children :-)
Yes I agree wharty but if you don't ask then you will never know.

I am still going to try something.

The two people I have been dealing with are women and seem quite genuinely intereted. I worked in Job Services for 8 years and Centrelink used to jump when the local member conducted a ministerial.

She is very respected and has been in the position for a long time and I know for a fact she is not a Gillard supporter but a Rudd fan.
Sleepy said
I don't think that CSA staff would be troubled by such campaigns. Their exemptions from scrutiny and multiple layers of legal and administrative protections seem to have gifted them a mentality of judge, jury and executioner. In reality their agency isn't far off that description.

I think that in order to attract enough support any public campaign will need a positive spin (as in "This initiative will save the taxpayer/improve cost effectiveness" etc) and mustn't sound like we're trying to shirk parental responsibilities. We all know that that's not what we're hoping for but considering the deadbeat dad mentality the two Joes have bred, it'll almost certainly be labelled accordingly unless it's a concerted and sensible approach from the beginning.

If a petition is pitched to both payers and payees, it'll appeal to a wider audience. We all know that CSA has little to no regard for the former but my research suggests that payees are just as dissatisfied as we are.

As a general rule I think the most effective approach would be to aim high (complete abolition of CSA and resumption of the ATO managing all income matters) with the widest possible appeal including payees.

I'm flat out with both jobs for the next two weeks (yep, due to paying 2k per month in CS it's the only way I can get ahead) but after that I'll put everything I've got into this.

This war in winnable.
 
I would have to agree with you that both payees and payers are dissatisfied with the system at present. It generally just takes too long to get anything done, it is nearly impossible to get the same person twice, and you can get three different answers to a question!

I believe that the ATO would be much more effective in collecting the child support amounts, and much more knowledgeable in the area of business. Self employed, and even company owners/directors certainly do get the bum steer from CSA, and sometimes SSAT too.

What needs to be pushed is that CS is meant for the child. There really aren't that many parents out there that do not wish to provide for their children. More that they are being harrassed and abused by an ex partner with an agenda. CSA have allowed themselves to be used as a vehicle for this behavior.

Claims made by both each party should be either confirmed by the other side, or cold hard proof provided to back up the claim. How can it be equitable for a payee to be able to make a claim, without evidence, and have the CSA take that as fact?

The department that handles this should have investigating powers, and standards that need to be met in order to substantiate a claim.

Eg. in my husbands case with the CSA, (the one where I was declared a financial resource in 2011), his ex wife stated in her reason 8 application that we lived in a 'beachside mansion'. Well, in a coastal town it was, and it did have four bedrooms, as we had 2 kids for 100% care and one for 40% care. It also had white ants, was built over 40 years ago, a leaking roof, no railings to the stairs, and was a rental. Not one person from CSA requested any information regarding our accommodation, but just took her word for it and stated that as my husband could afford to live in such a home then he he had access to my finances. Ha! I just paid the rent! We endured nearly 12 months of increased CS that we honestly could not afford, until the new assessment period arose, and thanks to Artemis I was able to then point the CSA in the direction of the finding in Jordan and Verne. However, for that period of time, I actually used the small amount of CS I received for my 2 children to pay the increase in my husbands CS. Go figure!

New assessment = now husband is the payee, (except is yet to receive a single cent and seriously cannot be bothered to chase the money due to the minefield he has already encountered with CSA!)

In that time, both of my children to my first marriage suffered and went without, I suffered and went without, and my husband felt about as low as one could, knowing that this had been brought upon us due to his choosing to procreate with this nasty and vindictive person, whose agenda of spite and hate was fully facilitated by CSA with not even a blink of an eyelid!

A child is a gift, not a weapon. To be a parent is a privilege, one which unfortunately some parents do not deserve.
I agree totally Kathg. Not a pretty story.

Over the weekend I did some research on Human Rights and I believe that the test case in the UK may also be relevant to Australian legislation and how it is abused.

It makes me wonder if anyone has challenged the CSA legislation from the point of view of social orientation and sexual discrimination based on marital status?

It is quite clear from this forum that second families are really suffering and I don't understand why sometimes the CSA wasnt to class the new parter as a financial resource but ignores the partner of the payee. If you look at the legislation that Centrelink apply there are three but the CSA only acknowledges two of them. This is one area that my MP is probing. You see when my partner was out of work for about 10 months the CSA would not accept this yet after selling all her shares was then refused Centrelink because her new partner was supposted to support her. Also her daughter had just turned 18years old in the May and was completing her HSC but that disn't count. She was also widowed and had no financial support from anyone. Under teh CSA legislation if it is your child from the prior marriage then that parent can apply to have the CSA extended but my partner did not qualify. How fair is this? It look slike discrimination based on marital status eg second rate family to me.
That's interesting regarding the Human Rights aspect of all of this. I approached Rob Oakeshott, the Mp for my area, in December last year, with several questions that I wanted him to ask the then Minister. One of those questions related to the abrigation of my children's rights under CROC, due to the actions of CSA.

I am still waiting for Mr Oakeshott to get back to me, but I do have regular email and phone conversations with his personal assistant…

If you would like a copy of those questions that seem to be unanswerable, I would be happy to send them to you. Maybe you will have more luck at your end?

A child is a gift, not a weapon. To be a parent is a privilege, one which unfortunately some parents do not deserve.
Hi Kathg,

Yes, I would love a copy of the questions. I called the MP's office two days ago and no response yet.

There has been another twist to our case/outcome. Stay posted it may be about to get interesting. Can't discuss yet.

Maybe we should join the new parenting party as it seems so difficult to get an outcome or sense.

Do you know if we can pass our own Bill in parliament?

Regards

Alessandro
Alessandro said
Maybe we should join the new parenting party as it seems so difficult to get an outcome or sense.
What new Party?
Alessandro said
Do you know if we can pass our own Bill in parliament?
NO
I'm sure you've seen this before Conan but do you have any suggestions on how to approach this?
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