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ACA CSA "Dad-Trapped-by-CSA" Story - 2 January 2008

There was a story about a 42yo Dad caught in the CSA trap, having to live with his parents on ACA last night.

For those who missed it or want to see it again.

http://aca.ninemsn.com.au/

Videos
http://video.msn.com/?mkt=en-au&brand=ninemsn&tab=m164

ACA CSA Video Segment - 2 January 2008 - Dean - Kathleen Swinbourne - Sue Price

Saw this

Saw this.

I think it's quite feasible that he has to live with his parents. I earn over $100,000 and once I have paid my ex $2,156 per month together with my own rent and car repayments - I too find it hard to make ends meet. There is no way I could afford a mortgage. And she of course, with further government funds, has no incentive at all to work and maintains a perpetual social life.

BUT the real killer is that the small amount of savings that I have got now has to also be blown on a lawyer because I have to take court action to achieve proper time with my children. She however has fraudulently claimed legal aid and has no problem with me blowing my savings on a court process. Paying all this money via the CSA doesn't give you any automatic right to have equal or substantial time with your children. To get that you have to go to court.

THIS WHOLE SYSTEM IS LUDICROUS - MAKES ME WANT TO SCREAM !!!
I saw the ACA Story and find CSA's comments out of touch and biased against Payers (usually Fathers).

I was paying CS of $2,360 per month and due to my Ex recently lodging a Change of Assessment for School Fees,  I now have to pay $2,470 per month.

Note that I have mortgage to pay, bills and etc. and ALSO Legal costs as I had to take legal actions against my Ex as she would not allow me to see the children as per agreed court orders (BTW,  she was found contravening Family Court Orders and was put on a Bond - meanwhile, I have legal expenses and lost contact with my children).  I objected to the increase and basically CSA says that I can afford to pay the $2,470 per month.

I don't know how I can afford this given my other financial commitments and legal costs.  And what's even more disturbing is that my Ex's total combine yearly Tax Free income is $65,000 (made up of Child Support, Centrelink Benefits A & B and her income) and yet she says it's not enough to support our two children!

Is CSA all about Child Support or Spouse Maintenance?

Media contact

I was going to say happy new year - no doubt the CSA will make sure that will not ring true.

Why don't you both contact the TV station about their show. They love "beat up stories" with human interest.




Executive Member of SRL-Resources, the Family Law People on the site (Look for the Avatars).   Be mindful what you post in the public areas. 
I don't get how they can not support kids on that income!!!  Or how someone can get $65,000 a year with work and child support and benefits. Benefits are reduced pro rata depending on child support and income, so on that money I would have thought her benefits work out to be negligible.

I work full time, on less than $38,000 a year, get full family tax A & B, $20 a fortnight sole parent and no maintenance for 2 children and still have to pay maintenance for my son. And that isn't tax free!!! I struggle but I make ends meet. I tried the new CSA online calculator and with the new rules I will have to start paying maintenance of approx $120 a month, plus pay the mortgage, rates, car payments etc.  

The system is definitely screwed, and I agree with the woman on the video that the supposed costs of raising children are blown out of proportion by the govt. They showed one mothers expenses which included over $200 in dental bills - what's wrong with using the FREE school dentist?

When you are swimming down a creek and an eel bites your cheek, that's a Moray.
Hi Monteverdi,

Funny you should mention contacting the show as that is exactly what I did last night - via email on their website. I pointed out that not only do I have to pay this exorbitant amount of money each month to the CSA but I also have to blow all my savings trying to get her to give me proper time with my children. AND in my case  I told them how she is happily working the system for free Legal Aid with the help of her parents - as it happens her father is a former public figure so I pointed that out to them too.

I'm sure it wont get any response but I will let you know.

However - Bugsiboy you should also send them an email. I guess if it stirs up enough reaction from people like you and I - it might get a bit more of a go. The more publicity we get on this the better.
 
Jadzia / GoodDad,  fyi… my Ex earns about $25,000p/a  (so tax will be min), gets Family Benefits A & B of around $12,000p/a  and what I pay in CS ($2,470 p/m)…  also gets $2 (whatever)perscriptions,  reduced travel and etc…

and I also sent of an email to the show tonight, told them what I'm paying and how I had to go to court to see my kids as per agreed family court orders… , so hopefully, ACA will do a story on this…

 I agree that is an amazing amount of money to get and still get centrelink benefits! It looks like they don't take into consideration the maintenance at all yet my understanding was that maintenance was to reduce the burden on the govt in paying out benefits. I went to the centrelink site and used the benefits rate estimator and put in the figures you quoted, then again without the maintenance amount and it made no difference. That fact in itself might make a story for ACA?

It explains why so many people are so gung ho on getting maintenance if it is over and beyond what you can bring in yourself and not affect benefits or tax.

When you are swimming down a creek and an eel bites your cheek, that's a Moray.
There are several issues with CSA:

The changes made to the Centrelink benefits if parents DIDN'T apply for CSA meant that people who were on a benefit would have it reduced if they did not apply for CSA.This meant more people were pushed to apply for CSA - the argument being that the Centrelink total outlays would reduce.

The relationship between CSA and the what Centrelink pays single parents WHERE THERE IS NO OTHER PARENT (eg dead, etc)

Generally what the government pays to support single parents $537.70 is MUCH LESS than what CSA provides - meaning that CSA payments are seen as some sort of 'sharing the wealth' or 'punishment' - NOT 'Support'. The CSA monies are the 'cream; for the non-working single parent.

When Vanstone argued for the changes to Centrelink payments and their reduction she used the words to the effect -  'Deadbeat dads' and there was a chorus of agreement from all sides of the house.

In reality of course the government faces a crises with 'social security' payments. Too many people receive free money and are CONDITIONED into expecting to be given money all the time. Women receive more government money than men and always have. Centrelink and related payments are consistently more than 1/3 of our total budget.

 Maybe I am not explaining myself well enough
Have you guys with looked at these CSA guides:

"A payee's child support income amount is based on the sum of a parent's taxable income for the last relevant year of income and their supplementary amounts for the last relevant year of income.

Most often, we look at our income and make no adjustment for the payee's income hence we pay too much. Sorry to hear you are in our CSA boat Jadzia.
Bugsiboy said
My Ex's total combine yearly Tax Free income is $65,000 (made up of Child Support, Centrelink Benefits A & B and her income).
This sounds like it needs to be brought to the attention of Centrelink and the above CSA link might work for you.
No-Justice I used centrelinks OWN online assessment to see what the figures would come to if child support was paid or not and it made no difference to benefits paid so "bringing it to their attentions" is hardly going to make a difference when it is their own formulas that work out entitlements.

If a fairer system is going to be pushed for it needs to be with politicians and lobby groups - Centrelink and CSA are only doing what they were set up to do.
 

When you are swimming down a creek and an eel bites your cheek, that's a Moray.
CSA specifically excludes Centrelink payments and the CSA payments themselves from the calculation of income. Also ignored are all the benefits like health card, rent assistance etc.

In reality the women who do not work and who receive Centrelink, family benefits, plus CSA are laughing all the way to the bank. They are effectively living a lifestyle of a middle income earner (tax free of course). That was the purpose of the legislation - to give women who don't work the lifestyle they deserve - nothing to do with the best interest of the children  - because if that was the case women would  be working flat out to financially support their children.

The wage and salary earning male is completely stuffed.

 Maybe I am not explaining myself well enough
Dont forget to mention the heavily discounted childcare! Do a course (any course) and you can put your kid in from 6-6 x 5 days a week.

Bonus - have the kid, grab the $5K, put it in daycare from 6 weeks and you don't even have to look after it!

Junior Executive of SRL-Resources

Executive Member of SRL-Resources, the Family Law People on this site (Look for the Avatars). Be mindful what you post in public areas. 
That's not just doing a course, anyone can put their kids into day care. And if you are on benefits yes it is heavily subsidised.
 

When you are swimming down a creek and an eel bites your cheek, that's a Moray.
Well I am not going to put up with it. If I am I not granted proper time with my children during the court process I am about to go through - including immediate and extensive holiday time, and if I don't get associated CSA payment relief, then I am packing up and moving to South America. To hell with it all. And believe me - I am absolutely serious.
GoodDad said
Well I am not going to put up with it. If I am I not granted proper time with my children during the court process I am about to go through - including immediate and extensive holiday time, and if I don't get associated CSA payment relief, then I am packing up and moving to South America. To hell with it all. And believe me - I am absolutely serious.
So are you going to Court for your benefit or that of your children?

You are going to walk away and leave them if you do not get want you want?

Somehow I think you chose an inaccurate user name.

Conan speaks

Do not be too harsh on the 'poor lad'.

I have heard from some ex Londoners, that South America is a great place to run to - oops sorry - retire to.

PS Try Belize; they speak English there.

Executive Member of SRL-Resources, the Family Law People on the site (Look for the Avatars).   Be mindful what you post in the public areas. 
I can understand GoodDads sentiments. I have also thought of how much less the kids would go thru without being torn apart by warring parents and that backing off / going away completely would at least achieve a stress free existence for them IF you are denied their company anyway.

When you are swimming down a creek and an eel bites your cheek, that's a Moray.

GoodDad is not alone

Take a $100,000 taxable income.

First goes $27,100 income tax

the $22,848 in child support (2 kids, $100K income)

and say another $20,000 in rent to house the children if allowed to see them (no housing, the kids can't stay anyway)

and another $11,440 a year to run a medium car ($220/wk - NRMA figures, medium car toward the bottom end of the range)

and then some food on the table and clothes to wear

another $10,000

which all come to $91,548

leaving a grand lifestyle discretionary income of $8,652. It would certainly take a long time to pay off the solicitor if the legals were $50K let alone $250K

AND THEY WONDER WHY PAYERS NOT SEEING THEIR CHILDREN FIND IT HARD TO REMAIN MOTIVATED TO KEEP WORKING!!!!!!!




For me - Shared Parenting is a Reality - Maybe it can be for you too!
oneadadc, have you perhaps forgotten the tax free threshold which would then increase the available income?
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